Logistics of 2 cars on a course?

[Gord]

Hi all,

I saw it mentioned in another thread about running 2 cars on a course at once. I've heard of this before and understand it is quite common in the SCCA, and it makes a lot of sense for getting more run time in a day.

However, I don't understand some of the logistical issues with doing it. The timing s/w I understand, and course layout, but:

1. Two cars running on course, and the first one spins, goes O/C, or gets lost; what happens to the second guy? Does his run get red-flagged and he goes again?

2. How is the stop box done? Is it no longer a stop box, but a slowdown area, or a rolling stop, etc.?

3. What happens if the first guy takes out some cones and they can't be replaced before 2nd guy arrives? Stop run?

4. Any other complications I haven't thought of?

I like the idea of being able to do more with the time available. We are now back at the Corel Center here on a new lot. It's the biggest/best one we've ever had I would say (Alcatel's lot was close...), and it would be easy to design a course to run two cars at once.

Thanks,

-Gord

[StewPiddass]

All of your concerns are pretty much bang on... I think, on a big enough course, it is feasable (and a great idea) to run 2 cars at a time to speed things up. Proof of this is Sunday's HADA regional, barring one or two small problems it went great. We (TLMC) will run 2 cars at a time too, but only if we have a lot of entrants (more than 50-60) For simplicity's sake we won't if we don't have to.

1. OC or spin out; an oc shouldn't affect too much, but in the event of a spin out (many downed cones) the second guy should get red flagged and run again. THis happened to me on Sunday when Hanif broke something (wasn't gonna complain, tires were warmer!)

2. Stop Box; you can totally still use a stop box, there should be plenty of time if the course is big enough (as done on Sunday)

3. Down cones; this is one of our biggest problems, Marshals need to be really on the ball here, if we're running 2 at a time we'll put in an extra marshal or two to make sure. And you gotta run!!!

4. Biggest thing for us is the timing, our timer does allow it, but the potential for human error is pretty big, as we rotate through timing for the day (not just one guy).

Like I said, we avoid it if we don't need to.


Man! am I longwinded!

[tanney]

The second car is usually sent when the first is 2/3-3/4 of the way done which usually equals 30+ seconds. Thus giving marshals that are paying attention lots of time to fix it. If in the first 2/3 of the run cones are knocked down, then the next car is held until the problem has been fixed.

If a car spins out and is not able to continue, then yes the second car is red flagged then slotted in line leaving at least 5 vehicles between.

The stop box is not an issue if the marshal is there to move the end cone.

Someone walking through the start or stop beam definitely screws up both cars on course and it does happen (right Andy?):o

[Marsh]

In my opinion it's all a matter of course design. HADA's course on Sunday, or the Picton regional were both perfectly set up for two cars. They had clear sections where the cars were no where near each other and never pointed at each other. However I've been to a few events where it could get a little hairy. I remember one MCO event where the stop box marshall had to dive across the hood of another car to avoid getting hit. He didn't make that mistake again...

I think this is why WOSCA gave it up. It was easier to make the course short than to try and fit two cars on it. (for us anyway, we just don't have much experience laying out a 2 car course).

[Gord]

Funny you mention that MCO event. It was a regular course (not 2 cars at once), and the stop box marshal was also the starter, and it was actually me who was that person who dove out of the way. :o

Needless to say, after that I was standing on the other side of the starting car... ;)

-Gord

[AndyC]

Guilty---I plead senility !

[AndyC]

P.S. what happened Wes--you came 2nd in BSS-- but do not show up in the results.!!

[tanney]

P.S. what happened Wes--you came 2nd in BSS-- but do not show up in the results.!!
I wondered when that would come up......

The organizer is not official scored in the event the they organize. Instead they are scored equal to their best event of the season. (That's why I am in 3rd place in the B1 Class, my first regional event I ran in B1 so that is my best event of the season so I scored 97.something for Sundays event, my score and class from the first event)

The logic behind that is the organizer will NOT be on their game the day they are organizing because of the organizational duties that most organizers have during the course of the day.