View Full Version : Solo 1 Recommendations
JunglyVR
06-23-2003, 05:31 PM
Hello All
I am very new to SOLO, i have allways been interested in joining and racing, ive done a few lapping days with other clubs, but i would like to do this more seriously. I would like to get a car that i would use primarily for the track, and i need some suggestions. I am more accustomed to working on VW's and BMW's , but i would like to get a rear wheeled drive car for the track. I am thinking of getting an older BMW 320i or a 325is (1980-1988). Is there anyone else that has a similar car on this board?...Any suggestions for cars that would be a good base for starting?...I once saw two older Porsche 944s's running at Cayuga, im not sure if they are part of this forum (one was a turbo and the other one was NA).........My budget for the car would be about 1500 for the car, so i could at least throw in a suspension and tires for this year and build over the years.....
any thoughts/help would be appreciated
Rob McAuley
06-24-2003, 01:12 AM
This is not a simple topic! There are lots of considerations.
First, all cars are classed according to wt/hp ratio and handling index. You have a couple of options. You can pick a car near the top of its class, and run it stock, or you can pick a car at the bottom of its class and fix it up where it needs it the most.
Track tires should be the first thing you get. They cost no points, but will bring down lap times as much as any other mod.
If you are planning on doing some work on the car (like suspension), look for a car that has a low handling index, and take full points for a killer suspension.
Plan on doing the free authorized mods when you move up a class. So, if your suspension costs you 8-9 PIPs and moves you up (hopefully just) one class, upgrade your brakes and think about a Cold Air Intake and Exhaust. They're free once you move from your stock class.
Of course, budget plays a big role. At least you're thinking of using the car primarily for the track. I'd love to add a cage to my car, but the family would be most upset.
Another consideration would be to pick a class that isn't so full that it would be tough to do well in, but pick one with enough competitors so you won't be paxed. In other words, avoid the classes with 8 competitors regularly coming out (GT1, GT3), and go for a class that always has 2 or 3 competitors (GT2 - hey that's my class!).
It is all rather complicated, and tough to sort out analytically. Your best bet is to watch the classifieds, and when you see a car with some upgrade potential, run it through the classification system and see where it will run. If you think you'll be happy there, buy it and just come out. Plan on taking a season or two, and lots of lapping days to get competitive, and have fun doing it!
you could buy a old 240sx..its rwd...light..and has lots of aftermarket parts....plus they are cheap....
JunglyVR
06-24-2003, 09:25 AM
Thanks a lot for the advice,
Where would i be able to find out what/where the classification system is?
Rob McAuley
06-24-2003, 09:56 AM
Start with the Rule Book (http://www.wiredmotorsports.com/soloontario/pdf/2003SoloIRules&Regs.pdf)
There are other vehicles now in the list, but you may be able to work out where any vehicle fits if you know the stock weight, HP, and can place it on the handling index scale (found in the rules).
As I said, you can kill yourself by analysing all the possibilities. If you see a car that would be fun to drive, get it classed, check out the competition from the previous results, and come on out!
MikeS
06-25-2003, 01:29 AM
Inexpensive OE parts
+ Excellent Aftermarket support
+ better-then-a-porsche suspension geomtery
+ cheap tire sizes
+ lotsa good used parts available
= Honda
Judging by your budget, I'd stay away fro the older exotics (read: porsche 944), stick to something reliable, fun and inexpensive.
Mike
an E30 3-series has tons of potential as a track car and shouldn't break the bank if you do things right. I say stick with what you know, though Adam's suggestion of a 240SX is a good one in terms of cheap RWD fun...probably a fair bit cheaper and just as fast if not faster than a E30 Bimmer. C4 (1984-1996) Corvettes are an excellent value too IMO and have tons of speed potential for a reasonable price. If I was going to ditch my Honda in favour of an affordable RWD track car, it would probably be one of these later two options or a low-cost Super7 replica that I'd build on my own.
I'm not sure if you'll be able to find a E30 3-series for $1500, but I have seen some '89 or '90 Nissan 240SX's go for less than that. A decent C4 Corvette would been considerably beyond that budget, for sure. If you can live with a FWD car, a 88-91 Civic Si hatchback or CRX is a very capable and fun track car that fits your budget.
I think the best advice is to keep modifications to a minimum at first, starting with r-compounds, upgraded brake pads, and maybe some upgraded shocks and springs. If the engine is in good shape, I'd say just leave it alone and focus on driver development and suspension tuning. Once you feel like you're getting every ounce of speed possible out of the car with a stock engine, then start thinking about making more power. Horsepower is seductive, but you have to make huge gobs of it before it'll improve your lap times as much as a race suspension, r-compound tires, and good brakes. And of course making huge gobs of horsepower gets very expensive very quickly :)
craig
06-25-2003, 07:31 AM
That cheap, RWD, and fun are only about four cars (besides those already mentioned): F-bodies, Corolla GTS, RX-7, and MR2. I have no idea how these fair in the rules.
With any RWD car, try to find one with a limited slip.
However, given you already know BMW's, I'd stay with what you know. The learning curve for mechanincal work on something like a 944 is pretty steep and can be very costly. I think there are only two words for a $1500 Porsche 944 - "parts car." Porsches are cars you buy if you *don't* want to modify anything, or have tons of money for mods.
JunglyVR
06-25-2003, 01:20 PM
Thanks a lot for all of your help, im slowly realizing the price of an older BMW and the problems associated with it..........I have had more time working on VW's than BMW's , but i just wanted the feel of a RWD track car. Our family currently has 2 older Golf's (one mine and one my bro's) and i was wondering if anyone on this board has a 85-82 VW that races.......It will probably be more affordable to keep than a old beemer would be, but would probably need a lot of modifications to be a solid track car.....having said that, i guess i get back to the point that was mentioned earlier; either get a better more $$ car and do little modification, or get a cheap car and modify it.........its a bit of a mystery...........and the season is going on, the longer i take to decide........any thoughts??....
BTW; I would probably end up getting another older golf (in better condition) since my frame is a little soft and the car is really getting older........
JunglyVR
06-25-2003, 01:41 PM
Thanks a lot for all of your help, im slowly realizing the price of an older BMW and the problems associated with it..........I have had more time working on VW's than BMW's , but i just wanted the feel of a RWD track car. Our family currently has 2 older Golf's (one mine and one my bro's) and i was wondering if anyone on this board has a 85-82 VW that races.......It will probably be more affordable to keep than a old beemer would be, but would probably need a lot of modifications to be a solid track car.....having said that, i guess i get back to the point that was mentioned earlier; either get a better more $$ car and do little modification, or get a cheap car and modify it.........its a bit of a mystery...........and the season is going on, the longer i take to decide........any thoughts??....
BTW; I would probably end up getting another older golf (in better condition) since my frame is a little soft and the car is really getting older........
Pete Mills, a long-time Solo 1 competitor, is very experienced with Golfs. He's building one to IT spec right now, as a matter of fact. Give him a call at Wheel & Tire Zone, (905)624-1577, and I'm sure he'll be very helpful.
IMO a Golf can definitely be made into a very competitive Solo 1 car. There's tons of engine options for that car, lots of go-fast parts available, and plenty of people with expertise building them.
you could get a 89-93 240sx for 500-2000 dollars...spend another 2000-3000 for race suspension..and then another 1000 for race rubber...and have a pretty quick RWD car....
in total for 3500-6000 depending on what deals you can find....
and the spare parts are cheap....it has a very developed multilink rear suspention...they look neat..and have more performance parts than for BMW...and are RWD......
think of them as a baby corvette...and they can be built up to 500rwhp with the engines they come with...if future power is at issue..
shameless plug for nissan...
i would wager that they are the ultimate starting platform for a solo 1 killer car... :)
hmmm golf......
FWD...boxy..german...pricey parts...tight engine bay....heavy...
if you want cheap german is not the way to go....
plus you said you wanted a RWD car....that kinda narrows the field down alot....
if you are looking for a used 240sx..
have a look at out club site.... in fact ..there is a burnt out one on sale right now...could be a good starter car? plus the paint is already stripped off for you :)
http://forums.son240sx.ca/
JunglyVR
06-25-2003, 02:28 PM
Adam ,
I can totally see your point, i am definately in considering all my options, and might i add you are doing a fine job for the nissan selling point. I guess its more about the unknown when it comes to me an nissan, and that just comes with experience. I have been searching on trader for a 240 and cannot find anything for less than 3grand............which is $$ once you dump the rest of the money on upgrades.......The golf option is somewhat more comfortable, only because ive pretty much dissasembled them and put back together ( young kid + first car + lots of time+no money = learning how to work on a car) ....and that is the only reason why i would consider it.........but as i said before, i love the feeling of a RWD car on a track, which is where im at now..........i really appreciate all the help you guys are giving me...i have been totally obssessed with Joining SOLO 1 for almost 3 years now, but have never had the opportunity until now.........is there any other sites to look for a car (buy&sell newspaper, supershopper, autotrader....?)
have a look at the 'Classifieds' at www.improvedtouring.com This is an american road race series for older/affordable cars, so you may just find a sweet deal on a fully prepped race car that you can just hop into and go have fun in! Of course you'd have to import the car from the U.S., but that's not as hard or as expensive as it might sound and with the strong Canadian dollar its more feasible than ever.
JunglyVR
06-25-2003, 04:43 PM
what an amazing site!!!!!!!!!!!!
I like the cars on the classified section, but it just makes me want to build one like them!.....it allmost takes away from the fun of owning a car you build, but it also gives you amazing ideas on what to do..........there are a lot of VW's that have been built up and done well!.............there is a couple 240's there as well, Thanks for the Tip!!
another site you may want to check out is http://www.clubvaper.com/ This is a local VW club and although I don't know any of them personally I'm told they're very much interested in autocross, lapping days, and other motorsports related stuff (rather than the usual neon underbody lights and ridiculous body kits). Perhaps this is a club worth joining for a VW guy like yourself, since members of clubs like this tend to know where all the good deals are for their chosen car.
ice/solo racer
06-25-2003, 08:30 PM
I know it was mentioned briefly in an earlier post but I'll say it again,85-87 corolla gts rwd!!
Mine was bought for $200 and has one class championship under its belt with the second well in hand!;)
AE86 power! Super terrific drift car!
Dave Barker
06-25-2003, 11:55 PM
Can't believe you guys haven't mentioned 89-93 5.0 Mustangs. These cars are not as cheap as they used to be and out of the box they need some suspension work but parts are cheap and available and the car is probably more improved by the addition of shocks and springs than any other car that runs our series. There are still some things about my ex 89 LX Hatch that I like more than my much newer Camaro. Certainly probablly the best "Bang for the Buck" (and at least they are NOT front wheel drive).
not to be nasty..but i think we left them out on purpose...
if we were drag racing...yes..that would be my first choice.....
good motor..strong..car.....
BAD suspension...which is not so great for solo 1...
Last time I looked suspension could be modified. Did the rules change? :rolleyes:
hehe Adam...
I have to agree with Dave and JC that a Mustang has lots of potential for affordable fun, since the engine has tons of power potential and the MANY shortcomings of the suspension design can be overcome with the correct modifications. The chassis will need some serious stiffening too, but because it's a domestic parts are common and affordable. Not a bad choice at all IMO! Greg and Chris have both shown that an older Mustang can be damn quick, with their lap times this year.
As you can see, everyone has their own favorites based on what they think makes for a fun ride. Heck, I'm still nostalgic about my Dad's '75 Corvette with the small block pumping out about 300 horsepower or so. That thing was fun to drive and the sound of a V8 is awfully sexy.
i agree IF you modify the suspension then the mustangs can be very quick...but he wants to do this low cost..so buying a car that you have to rip out or change most of the suspension is not the easy way to go.. IMO
i can't believe we forgot....
what about an old miata?
I think even the oldest Miata would be quite a bit more than $1500...though I agree this would be a fantastic starting point for a Solo 1 car. Lots of aftermarket support, turbo potential once you want big power, and awesome suspension design right out of the box. Just be prepared for the 'girly car' comments if you buy one! :p
maybe a really beat up somewhat wrecked one? or water damage salvage title?
RedRabbit Racer
06-26-2003, 12:44 PM
Stick with the VWs! hundreds of thousands of cars made - lots of spare parts available at a semi-reasonable cost. lots of parts can be used among various platforms - ie bigger audi 4000 brakes bolt on to the A1 VW.
With the VW's you can spend as much or as little as you want and still have something that is fun to play with.
JunglyVR
06-26-2003, 01:44 PM
As for a mustang what kind of suspension mods are needed ( other than chassis stiffening) would you mean completely remove the suspension and replace with something else??
RedRabbit Racer; I totally agree that VWs are the cheap and fun cars to drive, and i am considering them, i just wanted to see what was available in RWD and possible comparisons........other then the obvious, i remember noseplowing through shannonville in my corrado the last time i went to a lapping day.........which is OK once you get used to it, but i would rather be drifting though a turn/at least have more control.........mind you my brother has a 92 GTI that has an incredible suspension setup ( suspension geometry, solid frame, and lots of upgrades...its too bad he doesnt want to race it)...so in the end its still a toss up as to what i see in the best condition ( im looking more for a solid frame car than one with a good motor)....im not sure i would consider a Miata as a car...no offence to anyone that has one, its just not my type...............
DECH_92
06-26-2003, 05:47 PM
Wow I did not realize all the imports had such great suspension
Don’t even have to change shocks or springs, no body roll from the factory at all
Funny how there all up from stock classes
Yes a Mustang will need springs $200 shock $500 to 800 and a panhard bar $500
As a general rule and American older car is cheaper to get parts for then older imports.
Dave Barker
06-26-2003, 08:47 PM
Originally posted by DECH_92
Yes a Mustang will need springs $200 shock $500 to 800 and a panhard bar $500
Actually you don't even need a panhard rod and you can easily do the suspension work yourself. (Without the panhard you will be changing various rear suspension bushings often but they are really cheap). I had my used 89 LX Hatch for 6 years and ran numerous solo 1 events as well as lapping days and never touched the engine beyond plugs and oil.
Your point Greg is well taken. If all the import suspensions are so great how come so many of them are modified? I still stand by my point that the Mustang probably responds better to suspension mods than any other vehicle that runs Solo 1. You can't turn a sow's ear into a silk purse but you can make a pretty fast sow's ear!
Here is a heads up. There is a used mustang that will be sold shortly by an insurance company. The chasis is FUBARed but it has alot of other goodies on it. Trust me I know :(
getting the most out of a solid rear axle machine is very hard......case in point...trail braking.......ever follow a solid rear axle car around the track...especially under hard braking in a corner...or with bumps....
multilink independant rear suspensions are far superior...they really are a joy to drive....
all street cars are mushy..they all need springs....and more dampening
a mustang is great for one reason..the awesome 5.0 motor it has.... the POWER
(how many 4cyl mustangs do you see being fielded?)
anyway..you can see how everyone has different opnions on what solo car to get as a starter platform....
the options in RWD are limited..so choose wisely
heres my econo ride 86 onmi ghl shock 172 hp 4 cyl mod turbo didn't really need it i all ready had it . r-tires now we are going to add some suspension goodys i've had a few problems but this car runs strong handle decent and piss a few guys off and i have about $7000. into the whole deal its a real blast to race and with a little luck a may end up rookie of the year or even better top 3 in the highly competive gt3 class
DODGE RULES
MikeS
06-30-2003, 04:57 PM
the GLH that was dumping coolant at Shannonville?
hehe, play nicely Mike! We've all dumped fluid of some sort in our lives...
no it was oil and i pulled off as soon as i found out so far i have only missed 1 solo1 event
MikeS
07-01-2003, 12:44 AM
no harm intended, just curious
Sorry to bump an old thread but have you though of trying a Mitsubishi Starion or Chrysler Conquest (same car)? They're certainly not "tried and true" solo I cars but they're RWD and decent performers from the factory. (That said I've never owned one so I have no idea how they'd handle race use.) You'd have to import one from the US (pre-1987 since they don't meet Canadian child-safety seat standards or some beaurocratic crap like that.) Here's what they look like:
http://members.rogers.com/jayhtemp/spinstarion.gif
Anyway I have NO idea how good they'd be for Solo I use, I'm just posting this 'cause I think they're cool vehicles. They have a 2.6L turbocharged motor (with one of the best intercoolers from the eighties), coil-sprung live axel suspention, unibody, not too heavy, and should fit in your $1500 budget... Also it's been my experience that Mitsus do not rust (and if you're importing one anyway you can get it in Florida or somewhere like that) so you'll have a solid platform to start with.
Or, you could try a DSM (Talon / Eclipse). There are lots of them around and you could probably get a decent 1990-1992 AWD for around 1500 with a little searching. Not RWD but close... Also they're pretty easy to work on and lots of parts availible.
- J
RacerRick
07-21-2003, 03:37 PM
What about an older car - mopar A-bodies built from 63-76 have excellant suspension geometry, and parts availability. They can also be had very inexpensively, are very light generally, are emissions exempt for a street car, and will take any engine mopar has made.
Plus several variations are also vintage classed and can race in VARAC races and series.
Just be very wary of rust on these 25+ year old cars.
I just picked up two 65' Barracudas very inexpensively and will be setting one of them up for Solo 1 and vintage racing, while the other gets to be sold. It is being built for the GrassRootsMotorsports $2004 Challange and will fall into that budget easily.
Older Trans Ams, Z28's, and if you can find one - SVO mustangs. are also inexpensive cars to track prep - especially the 70-81 Camaro's since the circle track people use the front sub frames so much. Plus there is the small block chevy - the most inexpensive engine to build on the planet. Just try to get a manual trans one.
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