Reg event 5 , thanks COMP

[Tony Kloosterma]

Thank you, Thank you, Thank you.........................

A course that made you think, that had speed and that offered you a variety of choices.

Thats what my previous post was all about. We have more layouts like this and you will have 200 competitors every weekend. That was plain and simply a lot of fun.....

Thanks

Tony

[andrew1984]

yes, COMP.. great as usual.

[JoeT]

The course was great.. Two thumbs up.

Thanks again!!

[Logan]

Tons of fun, I loved every run I did, even the wet-n-messy ones.

[StewPiddass]

Yup, good time, more than 2 runs in the dry woulda been good... but that's not CCC's fault (I know vette guys don't pray for rain).

That was my first CCC event, I like the times on the bus!

[Taylor]

Fantastic Course (both courses this weekend were great).

But yeah, too bad about the rain, I really wanted to get up to some serious speed there. 1 run in the dry, another in the damp, the rest in the crap :) As I kept saying yesterday, if there was ever an good example of why we should run classes together, that was it.

The rain helped us with the 5 runs though, which was good. Could have gotten 6 in acutally.

Anyone know what the final competitor count was?

[AndyC]

Great course --so nice to get some speed up and choose your line.

[J.C.]

Nice layout! I also noticed not alot of time was wasted picking up pylons. As for the rain as Stew mentioned it did not help the corvette guys either.

[Logan]

Did everyone get the same number of runs?
I don't think everyone had to marshall by the time the day was over, and I know some people got stuck (some in the rain) out there for a long time, missing one, or maybe two runs?

[gatherer]

my understanding was those that mashalled got n the 5th run just before the fun runs .... I know thats when I did my 5th run

it was a great course lots of think was needed to choose which line to take (since the spacing allowed for different lines) I only regret 2 things 1 being the weather 2 running someone elses car that day since my car was in the shop

[ChrisM]

That was a great course. I only wish the rain had held off for one more lap, I finally worked up enough courage to shift into 3rd in the top section of the track.

Congrats to COMP for hosting one of the most fun events this year and managing to get 5 runs in for that many drivers.

[finboy]

if you missed your run, and the weather changed during the day

running by class would have made a difference, some might have had an extra run (that might have made the difference in placing 1st or 4th)


again.. every club does something different

[Eric]

Originally posted by Taylor
Fantastic Course (both courses this weekend were great).

But yeah, too bad about the rain, I really wanted to get up to some serious speed there. 1 run in the dry, another in the damp, the rest in the crap :) As I kept saying yesterday, if there was ever an good example of why we should run classes together, that was it.

The rain helped us with the 5 runs though, which was good. Could have gotten 6 in acutally.

Anyone know what the final competitor count was?

Thanks everyone for the kind words.

I was responsible for the course design. I had been following some of the posts concerning the tight courses at previous regional events, but to be honest they didn't really influence the course design. The plan was from the onset to have a flowing, challenging course, 60 seconds max. and able to accomodate a huge overlap safely so 2 cars could run at a time.

The stats on the event are:
95 entries
433 runs less 16 reruns netting 417 official timed runs or 4.4 runs per entry (some competitors left early and didn't take their final runs)

As far as the number of runs go, the first heat in the dry took us 45 minutes so 7 heats (6 runs plus 1 marshalling heat) would have been possible had the rain stayed away and we would have been finished by around 5pm. Actually, in hind sight we could have got 6 runs in even with the rain since some competitors left early and didn't take all their runs.

Running Classes Together
Many of our club members got together for a BBQ the day before the event and we considered alternative marshalling/run group arrangements. I had suggested we try an SCCA approach where the field of competitors is broken down into 3 groups - one runs, one marshals, one sits out. The 3 groups would be defined by classes. In order to minimize marshalling changes the group running would do back to back runs. We elected not to do this mainly because it makes for long marshalling stints and a lot of waiting around. Had we used this approach would have meant that 1/3 of the field would have got 2 dry runs and everyone else would have had to run in the rain. I think there would have been a lot of unhappy people.

Running heats by class would have been a possible approach, but the problem is it takes time to organize this. You have to tally up the number of entries in each class and then group the classes into marshalling groups of roughly equal numbers. When you have to register 95 entries and enter them all into the timing computer, there isn't time to do anything else if you plan on starting the event in decent time. With threatening weather coming in we wanted to get underway as early as possible. In the end we decided to go with our tried and proven approach - run numerically and assign marshalling duties numerically as you run through the order.

At our event running numerically had another advantage as well. We ran into a situation where unknowingly a competitor did not break the finish beam which caused all the times following to be out of phase by one until we caught it. By having the runs in numerical order it was easy to determine the sequence and thus fix the problem. It also allowed everyone to get at least one dry run in, except for me, but that was due to a lock nut key problem which had nothing to do with the event.

Eric Juraschka
President - Competition Corvette Club

[roooo]

We elected not to do this mainly because it makes for long marshalling stints and a lot of waiting around. Had we used this approach would have meant that 1/3 of the field would have got 2 dry runs and everyone else would have had to run in the rain.


Well. I was out marshalling for an hour.
And I only got 2 dry runs.

So I don't see how your reasoning against running by family/class follows through. The result was the same anyway.



You have to tally up the number of entries in each class and then group the classes into marshalling groups of roughly equal numbers.


It's not like you broke marshalling up into equal groups as it was .. so this doesn't work as an argument against running in groups.



We ran into a situation where unknowingly a competitor did not break the finish beam which caused all the times following to be out of phase by one until we caught it.


Maybe your timers should pay more attention?
Regardless .. you would have the grid list showing the order of cars so it is still fixable.

[Nissan Racer]

Originally posted by roooo
Well. I was out marshalling for an hour.
And I only got 2 dry runs.



You're lucky, I only got one dry run! Others missed runs entirely because of extended marshalling stints

[Eric]

Originally posted by Eric
We elected not to do this mainly because it makes for long marshalling stints and a lot of waiting around. Had we used this approach would have meant that 1/3 of the field would have got 2 dry runs and everyone else would have had to run in the rain.
Originally posted by roooo
Well. I was out marshalling for an hour.
And I only got 2 dry runs..

Exactly! If we would have used this approach and you were in the first marshalling group, you would have had 0 dry runs. By running in numerical order everyone got at least 1 dry run and a few lucky ones, like yourself got 2 dry runs.





Originally posted by Eric
You have to tally up the number of entries in each class and then group the classes into marshalling groups of roughly equal numbers.
Originally posted by roooo
It's not like you broke marshalling up into equal groups as it was .. so this doesn't work as an argument against running in groups.

roooo, you are missing the point. It is exactly because we did not take the time to split up all the competitors into equal marshalling groups, whether by class or otherwise that we were able to get the event started when we did.





Originally posted by Nissan Racer
You're lucky, I only got one dry run! Others missed runs entirely because of extended marshalling stints

We had an issue with competitors that reported for marshalling and then didn't go out to their marshalling posts, especially after it started raining. Some of the marshals stayed out after their stints, probably waiting for a relief marshal to show up. After it started raining the radios also started crapping out so we had difficulty communicating with the stations to see if anyone was waiting for relief marshals. We applogize to anyone that ended up pulling an extended marshalling stint. It certainly wasn't our intent for that to happen. It also was somewhat out of our control.

Sure would like to get my hands on the individuals who shirked their marshalling duty as I am sure those competitors that did extended marshalling stints would.

Note to future event organizers:
There is trade-off when you change marshals on the fly - you may get more runs in, but if marshals report in for their duty and then don't go out to their posts those marshals that stay out for an extended stint are going to be pissed off. You may be better off having defined breaks for marshal changes. At least then you can see which stations are missing people and you can get after the people that are supposed to be out there.

Eric J.

[Gary]

This was my first event. I had a great time and met lots of nice people. The course was certainly challenging, so much so that I made big mistakes every run. Still went faster each run though. I will be out again for sure.

I missed part of my marshalling stint because I heard the announcement for the marshals stop short of my number, and then left for a short break..(too much of Tim Horton's best heart starting fluid). Anyway, I picked it up best I could when I returned.

I know from years of kart racing that organizing any event is both a huge amount of work and a significant logistical challenge for the organizers. The work is just non-stop, and there's always something happening, including a bunch of stuff you hadn't planned on. So, I understand.....or at least I think I do. :D

The one suggestion I'd offer for you to consider is that you post the marshal's list, or verbally announce it at the drivers' meeting, so people will know in advance that they're going to have to marshall, and just when that will be. Might make the marshal changes easier and, provided I'm given notice, I promise not be be AWOL next time. (less Tim Horton's is on my list of tuning tricks for the next event):rolleyes:

Anyway, great event and fun people.

Gary

[ice/solo racer]

Gary your new SVT looked and sounded great on course-good to have you out for some fun.

[Marsh]

Great event. I have to grudingly admit that this was the best course this year (I thought it was too open when I walked it, but the results don't support that).

Like amny others myn only nit pick is the course marshaling system. Many people like it because you only marshal once during the day. But I never did like it. I don't like waiting that long between runs. And as everyone found out, it affects how many dry runs you get if it rains. Oh well to each his own.

Once again, good event!

[mike_moss]

Great course!


Wish it didn't rain!

[finboy]

Originally posted by mike_moss
Great course!


Wish it didn't rain and the lot was empty (quite a bit of close calls w/the parked cars).

please use the private message system with regards to saftey issues

[exST165]

Belated - but thanks COMP for a great event! I got 5 timed runs and I forget how many 'fun runs' I got in afterwards.

Also a big thanks to Wes and Hanif (spelling?) for their advice and words of wisdom to a newbie.

Being classed in BSS along with an AE86 trailer-queen was a bit disconcerting but I came out expecting to get blown out of the water (no pun intended) by the veterans so its back to the rule book!

Thomas

[ice/solo racer]

That AE86 trailer queen is up for sale!what car were you driving?

Don't forget that the corolla was initially built for BSS solo 2 and has had nearly 3 years of development now.I have it to the point now where I very rarely even adjust tire pressures thru the day,have them set very close right off the trailer.
Would been fun to have a dry day to see if I could have come even close to the fast guys,not likely as that long back straight wasn't exactly my cars strong suit.

[exST165]

That AE86 trailer queen is up for sale!what car were you driving?


1997 Black Integra RS. Number 53. Should I even ask what kind of $ it is going for?


Don't forget that the corolla was initially built for BSS solo 2 and has had nearly 3 years of development now.
<snip>


Not to sound like a whiner but ... It is not so much the time that has gone into developing that AE86 that had me worried but what has been done. My Solo II rule book puts "Toyota GTS fwd DOHC" in B1. That means (like me) it has 4 preparation points to play with in BSS. Now if it had a full cage and extinguisher it has three more prep-points right there to 'pay' for body & trim mods, but what about the suspension and engine? Definately had a modified exhaust system so that is 1 point down (6.0.A.1) and 3 to go!

I have painted myself into a corner with my Integra by installing Type-R front and rear sway bars, Type-R LSD and a lightened flywheel. Four points, three out of four to install factory Honda parts and the fourth to an overenthusiastic mechnic resurfacing a flywheel with 100,000+ km. Insult to injury is that compared to a stock Integra Type-R (which is classed in BSS) the Type-R still has lower springs and better shocks (6.1.8 - 3 points) 45 more hp and 1,700 more rpm (?6.0.E? 4 points?) and I think a quicker steering ratio. I can easily see ending up in BSP with a car still quite inferior to a BSS Type-R, all I have to do is put a header on it and I'm there. Why didn't I just buy a Type-R? Besides the money, because I would find it very difficult to fill the trunk of such a car full of sod and interlocking bricks the day before taking it to the track!

If I keep all my modifications to be stock Type-R parts (and forget about the flywheel thing) can I claim that I am a Type-R with non-performance engine swap? I guess I could try.

What does that have to do with your AE86? Just that either there is something very wrong with the classification system or I am rather foolish/stupid to end up directly competing against you.

Appologies for the rambling message,
Thomas

[J.C.]

Originally posted by ice/solo racer
Would been fun to have a dry day to see if I could have come even close to the fast guys,not likely as that long back straight wasn't exactly my cars strong suit.

I thought the exact same thing about Andrew in th Beetle. His 3rd run wich was in the rain was his fastest. He wasted his first 2 runs learning the course because he did not walk it. Well I guess that teaches him for being late. Next time if your going to be late atleast have a legitimate reason for it, something like " I was watching the F1." :p

[StewPiddass]

Thomas, I think you're looking at the wrong GTS, Tom's Corolla isn't FWD for one... not that I know alot about classing... but he is driving a 17 year old car with virtually no horsepower! hell you think you've got it bad, I drive an 11 year old, 1.5 litre, 102 horsepower Civic sedan but since I've got springs and a header i'm right in BSS with you!

[StewPiddass]

There were two ITR's and 2 SiR's (in BSS and BSP) doing 50 seconds or better, not to mention Wes in his dx coupe (same motor as me) doing a 47.4. I was fairly happy with my 51.1 considering my slug and huge street tires, i am also confident that with more than 2 dry runs (My ftd was 2nd run) I woulda been in the 49's.

I'm not sure how many events you've done before Thomas but your 55 is pretty decent, there is still lots of time to find in your car without doing any mods (as in everyones)

What am I trying to say?, it's the driver, not the car (man, am I starting to sound like Tom?)

I figure I'm stuck in the class I'm in and I gotta live with it!

[exST165]

Originally posted by StewPiddass

I'm not sure how many events you've done before Thomas but your 55 is pretty decent, there is still lots of time to find in your car without doing any mods (as in everyones)


Thanks for the kind words, I started to feel kinda low on Sunday after my first run came in at a 61.292! Almost getting lost will have that effect I guess. This was my second Solo II event plus the Solo II school and a couple of lapping days in prior years.

As for finding time - I found about 3 seconds during the fun runs with Hanif aboard (dang! could have been 18th!) and Wes posted a 50 and change during another fun run in my car. Not bad considering the seat wasn't adjusted to fit him properly. Thanks again guys for your help!

While it is all well and good to say that the driver is the most important component of any car, would anyone want to compete against people driving cars with more horsepower and better handeling? Anyway I think I've taken this thread far enough off topic ...

Thomas

[StewPiddass]

In theory an Integra with ITR suspension bits SHOULD/COULD out-handle most of the cars out there, and you've got way more hp than me (or Tom for that matter).

[haniforama]

The Integra weighs too much in stock form to be a class winner.

[tanney]

While it is all well and good to say that the driver is the most important component of any car, would anyone want to compete against people driving cars with more horsepower and better handeling?

I deal with that at every event. Mine is a 95 Civic DX, which is in the same base class as the Civic Si with, what, 10% more hp! Not to mention the highway gearbox.......

You go out and have fun and, if need be, have great battles for first, fifth, tenth, twentyeth, or what every. For you first few events, work on getting faster each run and being smooth with the steering and throttle. As long as you are always improving, results will come.

[ice/solo racer]

My AE86 corolla is RWD and starts in B3 for its root class and therefore has 8 prep points to bring it even(hopefully)with a B1 car using its 4 points or a typeR using its 2 points etc,etc.
Of course it boils down to the right combonation of improvements for the car in question,I could've used up most of my points on engine work-but without being able to use it whats the point?I have nearly 3 years into the prep on this car and have chosen the mods around what I could afford and what the car would improve the car the most.
All I can say is I believe the system is relatively fair,there's always going to be issues with differing car types in the same class no matter who writes the rules.
Simply boils down to the fact that I've down my homework and built a car to fit the rules,anyone else can do the same.

I'm asking for $6000 with the car trailer,the complete car specs or listed in the for sale section of this forum.

[exST165]

Originally posted by ice/solo racer

Simply boils down to the fact that I've down my homework and built a car to fit the rules,anyone else can do the same.


And you should be congratulated for the fine job that you have done to build a car to the rules. My whole point was that it is rather disconcerting as a newbie running their daily driver to see your car in the same class.

Thomas

[Marsh]

Before Tom we called it the "Tony McGrath" class. There is some class that the regional hot shoe is going to run in. It just happens that this year Tom is the guy and he's running probably the most popular class for newbies, since most of them show up in lowered compacts.

When I started out in 98 it was CSS when Tony McGrath had his Camaro. Everyone vacated the class like it had the plague. C-family is just starting to recover now...

[ice/solo racer]

Psss hey Marsh,you forgot last year too!;)

So when is this mass exodus from BSS going to begin?,I only see the class growing and growing and growing:)

Oh yeah exst165,if you install a roll bar,fire extingusher the negative prep points can only be applied if you move up to the street prepared classes,so a B1 car can only have a total of 4 points to run in super stock.

[J.C.]

Most likely next year alot of those BSS runners will be in BSP. The new rule changes will probably make that happen.

Then again many of those cars in B won't be in B anymore.

[StewPiddass]

I'm scared of moving up to BSS... then again maybe some of those guys are gonna hafta move up too. I'm guessing my Civic will stay in B.

[exST165]

Originally posted by J.C.
Most likely next year alot of those BSS runners will be in BSP.


Resisting the temptation to put lowering springs or a header on my car will be difficult.

Originally posted by J.C.

The new rule changes will probably make that happen.

Then again many of those cars in B won't be in B anymore.


I took a look through the Solo II forum and didn't see any topics concerning proposed rules for 2004. Are we moving towards the Solo I handling + hp model? Where can I read up on the discussion? Thanks,

Thomas

[tanney]

Thomas, it has not been confirmed yet, but chances are we will be going to the CNAC rule set for 2004, standardizing Solo 2 rules across the country.

The 2003 CNAC Rule book can be found at CNAC Rules Web Page (http://www.cnacsolo.ca/rules.html)

[J.C.]

Tod I would be most concerned of where this man ^^^ ends up. He will most likely be your biggest concern.



P.S. Like I said last Sunday blame Wes its his fault :D

[ice/solo racer]

The good news for current BSS cars is that next year I won't be around with the corolla(hopefully somebody will be though),if I do attend any solo 2 it'll likely be with the crx which is a B mod car under the current rules.

[gatherer]

wow I just got back from reading those rules...this I like:

H. Minimum Dimensions

Minimum gate width shall be no less than four (4) meters wide as measured between the pylon bases. Minimum distance between cones in a linear slalom shall be fourteen (14) meters as measured between the pylon bases. Minimum turn radius shall be no less than ten (10) meters and the radius of one turn must not overlap the next turn.


however I was going through the car classification for next year and with a 93 civic (stock)I'd be classed in F Super stock??? I'm confused

[J.C.]

Those rules are also in the current rules.