Shifter Karts

[Shaman]

What is the 2004 ruling on shifter kart participation in Solo-2?

[AlienDNA]

3.2.B.i.d - Minimum wheelbase = 72", track = 42", wheel diameter = 10".

It'd be a damn big shifter kart...

[Shaman]

Yeah, I had heard that they are more or less outruled in Solo 2. Too bad.

[tanney]

Karts are not being allowed under any solo rules (1 or 2) in Canada in 2004.

[partial quote]
Officially, it is the intention of SoloSport to exclude karts from solo in the 2004 GCR's.
[end partial quote]

This is taken from the ASN Canada FIA National Solosport Committee October 30 2003 minutes.

Now it was also mentioned that a club in BC ran a dual sanctioned event....... we'll see what becomes of that and see if it will be disallowed in the future.

I know, not what you wanted to hear.

[tanney]

Why? Well, if two vehicles are on course, one being a kart, and something bizaare, mind boogling, outrageous happens and there is a collision...... Who do you think will lose the biggest? It will probably result in loss of life.

[Dave]

well, we never had anything but other shifter karts on the track at the same time during Solo 1 events in the past, but I can still understand their thinking to a certain extent since in theory an accident could even happen in the paddock where someone in a shifter kart could become an unintentional speed bump. That would be bad.

[AcidGord]

There was a group from New Brunswick at the Atlantic Region AGM that was petitioning for karts to be allowed to run at Solo events and what was ruled was that karts were NOT allowed to run at the SAME event as cars for insurance reasions. This was an absolute 100% ASN decision.

... HOWEVER ...

There is absolutely nothing preventing two events from being run on the same day which is what the folks in NB will be doing. The day starts, the course is set up and run by the cars. The car Solo event ENDS. The course is left the same and the kart event begins under its own insurance, own club sponsorship (Could be the same club as the cars or different) and its own rule set. They are then allowed to run. This follows all ASN rules and is perfectly acceptable to all the organizers.

Apparently the kart clubs here did some invesigation and solo competition since its one one car at a time falls under test and tune insurance which is very reasonably priced. (A figure something like $350 for 6-10 events or something like that was mentioned, don't quote me)

So there WILL be karts doing Solo 2 in the atlantic region this year, at least for an event or two to guage interest anyway.

[gatherer]

what about those SAE Karts at the PITL and WOSCA events this year are they shifter karts?

[AlienDNA]

Originally posted by gatherer
what about those SAE Karts at the PITL and WOSCA events this year are they shifter karts?

It could be argued that they are big shifter karts. Formula SAE rules only mandate a minimum wheelbase of 60" and a minimum wheel size of 8", so they may well not qualify for Solo II, depending on how big they actually are.

[TFGR]

Originally posted by tanney
Why? Well, if two vehicles are on course, one being a kart, and something bizaare, mind boogling, outrageous happens and there is a collision...... Who do you think will lose the biggest? It will probably result in loss of life.

So.....just don't run other cars when the karts are on!

[tanney]

When the governing body for motorsport in this country and the insurer say no karts allowed, there are no karts allowed.

Unless you like running events without insurance and affiliation........

[Doug P]

What if you added NOS to the kart? Could ya run then? Could ya? :D

[Marsh]

Originally posted by AlienDNA
It could be argued that they are big shifter karts. Formula SAE rules only mandate a minimum wheelbase of 60" and a minimum wheel size of 8", so they may well not qualify for Solo II, depending on how big they actually are.

I've only ever seen one SAE car running less than a 10" wheel. Most run 13's. However they are all too short a wheel base. Other than that they would be legal. They run full cages and harnesses. The other hangup is that SAE only require M helmets, but under our rules a Mod car with slicks and a cage needs an SA helmet.

[Greg F]

What exactly are SAE cars built for anyway? Is there an SAE series that they race in or is it just for kicks, 'n' shitz, 'n' giggles 'n' shitz and stuff?

[Marsh]

They are porpose built for one weekend. The Forumal SAE competition in Pontiac is held from Thursday to Sunday of the Victoria Day long weekend (or more specifically the weekend before Memorial day weekend). It is open to any engineering school. Cars can only compete once, so rules require an all new car every year. For this reason there are a fair number of old SAE cars floating around in the US. So many that SCCA is creating an SAE class for nationals, rather than have them running against A-mod cars. There are now also an Australia competion (FSAE Australasia) and a British competition (Formula Student, which I believe U of T won this year?)

The formula is 610 cc 4 stroke engine (or less). 20mm restrictor. A single throttle, which must be located up stream of the restrictor(turbo and super chargers are allowed, so long as they are after the restrictor). All other engine components must be down stream (The do allow methanol and there is a different restricor diameter for teams running methanol). The car must have 4 wheels and be open wheel. There are roll over and crash structure rules, but beyond that it's pretty much wide ope.

BTW for many students the SAE team is their resume. Many firms in Detroit have hiring policies that they will only take students that have done SAE Collegiate design competitions. There are other besides Formula SAE. You can learn more here:
http://www.sae.org/students/student.htm

[Greg F]

So are we doing our youth a disservice by not allowing them to enter our events? If the Americans can run their cars in the SCCA while our guys have less opportunities to develop their cars, we may be helping to relegate them to the status of also-rans.

I like the idea of letting them run with no other cars on the track.

[roooo]

There are entire racing series for karts ... why bother to have them in Solo2?

I thought I read somewhere that karts are being dropped from SCCA Solo2 as well for at least two reasons:

1. Courses that are fun for cars are boring for karts.
2. So few karts were coming out that it was more trouble than it was worth.

Although Marsh says there is going to be a separate SAE class .. for Nationals. Is that a manatory class for all Regional events as well?

[Marsh]

Originally posted by roooo
Although Marsh says there is going to be a separate SAE class .. for Nationals. Is that a manatory class for all Regional events as well?

No, no, SCCA nationals!

And BTW karting venues and races are dissappearing. I've had 5 emails in the last 2 years from kart racers wanting to run with WOSCA. Mind you once they see our lots they usually go away.

[roooo]

Yeah, SCCA, that is what I meant to be referring to.

[Greg F]

Oops, I should clarify that I was talking strictly about the SAE cars and the students who work on them.

Sorry for the confusion...and the slight hijacking.;)