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10gt61
12-05-2016, 03:10 PM
Just wondering what the top performing tires were this year? My Dunlop ZII's are getting old so I'll need new rubber for 2017.

Slowpoke
12-05-2016, 04:01 PM
Just wondering what the top performing tires were this year? My Dunlop ZII's are getting old so I'll need new rubber for 2017.

Street tires, Kelly? No changes from 2016 tire recommendations that I know of, except the introduction of the Toyo R888-R with the same medium GGG compound used in the R888 and RA1.

Gwoody27
12-06-2016, 08:37 AM
The Bridgestone RE71R has the most grip and was very popular among the faster competitors.

10gt61
12-06-2016, 12:21 PM
Yes, street tires. 200 tread wear. Similar to the ZII's. Can drive to track and take part in lapping, hpde's etc.
I have also heard the RE71R's are popular, but they don't come in the size I'm looking for. However the RE11's do. They have very good reviews on TR.

wparsons
12-06-2016, 02:28 PM
RE11's or RE11A's won't have the grip that any of the newer tires have, but they're still decent.

I would look at the ZII SS, they're apparently all the good parts of the original ZII but slightly better across the board. They aren't as fast as the RE71R, but are still good.

gaspeddle
12-07-2016, 08:22 AM
Hey Kelly - I'm most likely going with the RE11's once my Michelins are done... won't set FTD (as others have pointed out) but seem to take lapping well in heavier cars.

... also, you can get them (or any Michelin / Bridgestone) special ordered in through Costco.

Dave Barker
12-07-2016, 08:42 AM
RE71Rs and BFG Rival Ss seem to be the fastest "200"treadwear tires but I don't think they have much longevity on the track at least for heavy cars, as they are designed as autocross tires. Maybe Carsten can comment .

wparsons
12-07-2016, 10:44 AM
Forgot to mention it above Kelly... I'd also look at the AD08R's, they're a 180TW so they get left out of most street tire discussions for classes that require 200, but they're still a good option.

Similar grip (on my car at least) to an RS3 v2, but they wear WAY better.

10gt61
12-07-2016, 11:43 AM
Ya I do have to consider the weight of the car so need tires that are appropriate. Didn't know Costco sells Bridgestone! I usually go to Tires23. Will have to check prices. RE11's sounding good so far for my purposes and come in the size I need. (275/40/18). My currents ZII's are 275/35/18, great on track but with the lowered suspension just a bit too low on the street. Speed bumps and potholes are a challenge!

Saj5DJ
12-07-2016, 01:39 PM
Ya I do have to consider the weight of the car so need tires that are appropriate. Didn't know Costco sells Bridgestone! I usually go to Tires23. Will have to check prices. RE11's sounding good so far for my purposes and come in the size I need. (275/40/18). My currents ZII's are 275/35/18, great on track but with the lowered suspension just a bit too low on the street. Speed bumps and potholes are a challenge!

Rival S's bud. No question.

Gary
12-07-2016, 06:28 PM
I had a set of Rivals, but not the Rival S. Then I bought the Dunlop ZII. Based on this experience, I am going back to Rivals for 2017, this time the S version.. The Dunlops worked OK, but I felt more confident on the Rivals.

Saj5DJ
12-07-2016, 08:11 PM
The S's are night and day ahead Gary. Track, autox, whatever. I doubt you'll be dissapointed.

Life's too short and racing is too expensive to do it on uncompetitive tires.

Dave Barker
12-07-2016, 11:23 PM
If you are looking for the Mustang, you might consider Michelin Super Sports which are never going to win you anything but will last a long time and be good in the wet.

If you want to spend more money, try Pilot Sport Cup 2s. Faster than the Super Sports but at a 180 treadwear rating they still aren't as fast as the 200 treadwear RE71Rs or Rival Ss. OTOH, I suspect they will last longer than Yokohamas. (Before Martin or Eric chime in, Kelly might be driving a Mustang which doesn't have the power to provide enough wheel spin to wear out the Sport Cup 2s that quickly ;) )

10gt61
12-08-2016, 01:25 PM
If you are looking for the Mustang, you might consider Michelin Super Sports which are never going to win you anything but will last a long time and be good in the wet.

If you want to spend more money, try Pilot Sport Cup 2s. Faster than the Super Sports but at a 180 treadwear rating they still aren't as fast as the 200 treadwear RE71Rs or Rival Ss. OTOH, I suspect they will last longer than Yokohamas. (Before Martin or Eric chime in, Kelly might be driving a Mustang which doesn't have the power to provide enough wheel spin to wear out the Sport Cup 2s that quickly ;) )

Super Sports on the list. Don't really like the 300 TW rating though. Sport Cup 2's don't have my size. As for wheel spin, no prob, lots there if that's what I want, right foot controls how much! (Or are you referring to the V6 Mustang I may have access to? - That would change things.) :)

Brutus
12-31-2016, 10:32 PM
I have 2016 experience on both the Michelin Super Sports and the Yokohama AD08Rs.

I ran the Super Sports on my C6 Corvette GS in 18's / 19's for lapping at Mosport DDT, GP, SMP and TMP. The car is stock except for track brake pads. I wanted a top performing street tire that would handle 20 minute lapping sessions without coming apart and of course last forever.

I've put 8,000 k on the tires, in excess of 200 laps and they are at 6/32". Like others have said, they are not the fastest tire but with the traction system completely turned off the car loves being thrown around and hung out > the tire is extremely predictable and easy to get back in line. I'd call the Super Sport a great street tire that can handle serious track thrashing without wearing quickly.

I also ran the Yokohama AD08R on my '67 Acadian in 18's / 19's for the Canadian Track Driving Adventure (aka Ontario 1500). The car is somewhat modified. I wanted a great tire for autocross and tire attack that met their tire rule ... and I could also safely drive on the street as I wanted to drive my car from track to track.

Although I used 2 set of AD08R's for the CTDA, I could have completed the event on one set. From the get go I was impressed with this tire's stick but more importantly how progressive it was both at and beyond the traction limit. My car could best be described as very analog, in that you drive it 100% by your senses > feel being the major one. The AD08R's feedback suited this perfectly allowing me to drive smooth on the track, yet as loose as I dared to on the autocrosses. The bonus was that it provided the same confidence in the wet and in the dry.

I would consider the AD08R a great 180 TW competition tire - wet or dry - that is streetable.

My opinions based on my experiences.

Jud

max attack
01-01-2017, 11:28 AM
I have 2016 experience on both the Michelin Super Sports and the Yokohama AD08Rs.

I ran the Super Sports on my C6 Corvette GS in 18's / 19's for lapping at Mosport DDT, GP, SMP and TMP. The car is stock except for track brake pads. I wanted a top performing street tire that would handle 20 minute lapping sessions without coming apart and of course last forever.

I've put 8,000 k on the tires, in excess of 200 laps and they are at 6/32". Like others have said, they are not the fastest tire but with the traction system completely turned off the car loves being thrown around and hung out > the tire is extremely predictable and easy to get back in line. I'd call the Super Sport a great street tire that can handle serious track thrashing without wearing quickly.

I also ran the Yokohama AD08R on my '67 Acadian in 18's / 19's for the Canadian Track Driving Adventure (aka Ontario 1500). The car is somewhat modified. I wanted a great tire for autocross and tire attack that met their tire rule ... and I could also safely drive on the street as I wanted to drive my car from track to track.

Although I used 2 set of AD08R's for the CTDA, I could have completed the event on one set. From the get go I was impressed with this tire's stick but more importantly how progressive it was both at and beyond the traction limit. My car could best be described as very analog, in that you drive it 100% by your senses > feel being the major one. The AD08R's feedback suited this perfectly allowing me to drive smooth on the track, yet as loose as I dared to on the autocrosses. The bonus was that it provided the same confidence in the wet and in the dry.

I would consider the AD08R a great 180 TW competition tire - wet or dry - that is streetable.

My opinions based on my experiences.

Jud

Haha,the Acadian is "somewhat modified".....yeah there's an understatement for ya.:)

max attack
01-01-2017, 11:31 AM
I hear a couple brands are releasing 245-40-15's,perfect for say boosted miatas with a bunch of areo work.:)

Dave Barker
01-01-2017, 01:17 PM
Jud, where did you get your AD08Rs from? Certainly there seemed to be a serious shortage of my sizes in Canada last year.

Brutus
01-01-2017, 01:33 PM
Dave, my local Yokohama dealer ordered them directly from Yokohama Canada. The 4 of 18" and 2 of the 19" arrived in about 6 weeks > as in March. The other 2 of 19" arrived in late April. It would seem that Yokohama Canada doesn't stock huge numbers of some of the AD08R sizes, so I guess because I gave my dealer a firm order in January, which then became a backorder between the dealer and Yokohama Canada, assured me of getting them.

Failing this, there is always Tire Rack and pick them up in Niagara Falls at one of those 'parcel ship to' warehouses. Of course in keeping Canada great you'll pay your HST of 13% at Canada Customs.

Hope this helps. BTW I do have 8 used ones taking up space in my shop.

Jud.

IWannaGoFast
01-01-2017, 09:03 PM
RE71Rs and BFG Rival Ss seem to be the fastest "200"treadwear tires but I don't think they have much longevity on the track at least for heavy cars, as they are designed as autocross tires. Maybe Carsten can comment .

I really liked the RE71Rs, definitely faster than the ZII SS, but they didn't last very long, for reference, I picked up the last set in July and after 4 time attack days (DDT and SMP) and 2 MIR lapping days they were down to the cords and that's with regularly rotating them. I'd estimate I put about 4 hours of total track time on them

Slowpoke
01-02-2017, 12:09 PM
I would consider the AD08R a great 180 TW competition tire - wet or dry - that is streetable.

My opinions based on my experiences.

Jud

Great description, Jud! I could happily slalom or lap the AD08R's with confidence in any conditions largely because of their feedback to the driver, but they require more aggressive front alignment for me than the RE71R to work properly. The AD08R will stay at "peak grip" longer than the RE71R, and the tread doesn't disappear before they harden.

MartynD
01-16-2017, 02:04 PM
RS4's are now appearing on Tirerack's site with an estimated March 17 date. and in 245/40/15

alexb29
01-16-2017, 07:14 PM
Hi guys! Just gonna throw this out there...

Since I struck out on my own last year with 'Miata Dave', Chris Kennealy (formerly of Simply Tire) has joined us to do wheel and tire. We'll be able to get RE71, AD08R, RS3 (looking to get RS4 as well), Toyos, Michelins... we've got access to a slew of stuff, for the track or the street. Rival S and Direzza Star Spec are harder to get, but can be gotten from what I hear.

I mention this because I read a few posts mentioning 'crossing the border' or 'no Canadian retailer'. ;)

Not sure what the etiquette is on posting business-related things on the Forums. Let me know if I'm doing something wrong. :)

nowcritical
01-17-2017, 08:51 PM
If you are looking for the Mustang, you might consider Michelin Super Sports which are never going to win you anything but will last a long time and be good in the wet.

If you want to spend more money, try Pilot Sport Cup 2s. Faster than the Super Sports but at a 180 treadwear rating they still aren't as fast as the 200 treadwear RE71Rs or Rival Ss. OTOH, I suspect they will last longer than Yokohamas. (Before Martin or Eric chime in, Kelly might be driving a Mustang which doesn't have the power to provide enough wheel spin to wear out the Sport Cup 2s that quickly ;) )

I found a new strategy for my Sport Cup 2 for last year where I only use them for track days and events and swap out to a normal street tire for everyday use. I ran over 32 track days on 2 sets. To my surprise, the front tires were the ones to go first and I did loose some to tread delamination which is an issue if you get the tire pressures wrong.

I spent most of the days at mosport big track and spent very little time at other tracks.
I have driven on slicks and full race tires and these are very close to what a full slick will grip like.

Keep in mind that I also use the run flat version of the tire.

nowcritical
01-17-2017, 08:59 PM
Dave, my local Yokohama dealer ordered them directly from Yokohama Canada. The 4 of 18" and 2 of the 19" arrived in about 6 weeks > as in March. The other 2 of 19" arrived in late April. It would seem that Yokohama Canada doesn't stock huge numbers of some of the AD08R sizes, so I guess because I gave my dealer a firm order in January, which then became a backorder between the dealer and Yokohama Canada, assured me of getting them.

Failing this, there is always Tire Rack and pick them up in Niagara Falls at one of those 'parcel ship to' warehouses. Of course in keeping Canada great you'll pay your HST of 13% at Canada Customs.

Hope this helps. BTW I do have 8 used ones taking up space in my shop.

Jud.

One item you need to watch for when ordering high-performance tires in the winter for delivery is the cold. Most high-performance rubber does not react well to being frozen during shipping across the globe and heat cycled in and out of hot to cold back to warm.

Just a note

Slowpoke
01-18-2017, 02:06 AM
I found a new strategy for my Sport Cup 2 for last year where I only use them for track days and events and swap out to a normal street tire for everyday use. I ran over 32 track days on 2 sets.

Thanks, Martin. How was your outlap? Did they need some heat to work? Any street tire purchase that I make has to be Autoslalom friendly for the Ontario 1500. Though Pirelli Trofeo R are formidable in a 3-hot lap time attack session, the outlap is for building heat ONLY, not for setting a time..

Dave Barker
01-18-2017, 08:18 AM
Stephen, I used the non run-flat Sport Cup 2s last year in OTA. They clearly need some heat to work but are more stable at higher temps than some of the other "hot" tires. Typically my last lap or middle lap of the session was the fastest and not the first. Some of this is my driving style but some is also the need to heat the tire. When using Rivals or RS3s, my fastest lap was almost always my first lap (which really doesn't suit me well).

My guess is that the Sport Cup 2 is not a good autocross tire. Unlike Martin, I did not find the Sport Cup 2s to be in the same league as R comps as I was consistently faster on 3 year old NT01s at MIR and Shannonville but to be fair, these were not back to back tests on the same day.

I am very interested in your OTA experience with the Yoks especially re- lap to lap variation and stability when hot.

nowcritical
01-18-2017, 09:33 PM
Thanks, Martin. How was your out lap? Did they need some heat to work? Any street tire purchase that I make has to be Autoslalom friendly for the Ontario 1500. Though Pirelli Trofeo R are formidable in a 3-hot lap time attack session, the out lap is for building heat ONLY, not for setting a time..

You need to build heat into the tire to make it work. So out lap are generally spent braking to build more heat into the tire and generate grip. Once up to temp they work well. The Trofeo R is a grippier tire from what I have heard. It has about 1/2 the life span on the SC2. It is very much in the same vane that it needs heat to work.

nowcritical
01-18-2017, 09:41 PM
Stephen, I used the non run-flat Sport Cup 2s last year in OTA. They clearly need some heat to work but are more stable at higher temps than some of the other "hot" tires. Typically my last lap or middle lap of the session was the fastest and not the first. Some of this is my driving style but some is also the need to heat the tire. When using Rivals or RS3s, my fastest lap was almost always my first lap (which really doesn't suit me well).

My guess is that the Sport Cup 2 is not a good autocross tire. Unlike Martin, I did not find the Sport Cup 2s to be in the same league as R comps as I was consistently faster on 3 year old NT01s at MIR and Shannonville but to be fair, these were not back to back tests on the same day.

I am very interested in your OTA experience with the Yoks especially re- lap to lap variation and stability when hot.

Dave,

I find the SC2 run flats closer to a slick or a race tire Vs an R compound. I find that the grip level is very close to Hoosier or Micheline slick. I think managing tire pressures and temperatures to keep them in the optimal range is key , very similar to any race tire.

scorcherjf
01-30-2017, 06:54 PM
Dave,

I find the SC2 run flats closer to a slick or a race tire Vs an R compound. I find that the grip level is very close to Hoosier or Micheline slick. I think managing tire pressures and temperatures to keep them in the optimal range is key , very similar to any race tire.
The SC2 run flats (ZP version) do indeed look like they are significantly different compared to the normal SC2.

Cup 2 ZP: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/BigPic.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+Cup+2+ZP&sidewall=Blackwall

Cup 2 N0: http://www.tirerack.com/tires/BigPic.jsp?tireMake=Michelin&tireModel=Pilot+Sport+Cup+2&sidewall=Blackwall

Dave Barker
01-30-2017, 09:52 PM
Wow, never noticed this before. Unfortunately available in very limited sizes.

nowcritical
01-31-2017, 09:36 PM
Wow, never noticed this before. Unfortunately available in very limited sizes.

The ZP is a very different tire. The sizes are limited and not many shops have the know how on how to mount these. But when you get the pressures and temperatures right they are amazing.

My 3 1/2 cents

Brutus
02-05-2017, 05:31 PM
One item you need to watch for when ordering high-performance tires in the winter for delivery is the cold. Most high-performance rubber does not react well to being frozen during shipping across the globe and heat cycled in and out of hot to cold back to warm.

Just a note

Your post brings up an interesting question. Since we live in the northern hemisphere and tires produced in Japan, Korea, Germany, Italy, Indiana and China are shipped across the northern hemisphere, what's your advise on how and when we should best purchase tires for the 2017 competition schedule that have not been frozen at some point between when they came off the production line and they get mounted on wheels?

Further to your post. It's my understanding that 'heat cycled' refers to bringing a tire up to it's optimum performance operating temperature, which could be anywhere between 50 and 90 C (depending on the compound mix) and then allowing the tire to cool down slowly to ambient temperature. This activity is a step in the final curing process of the tire rubber. I also understand that the tire industry likes storing their tires in a 15 C or warmer environment as it lengthens a tire's shelf life. To this end, unless the reference in your post to hot or warm is a temperature of at least 50 C, I don't believe it would have any effect on the heat cycling process.

Jud.

dubya_rx
02-06-2017, 12:04 PM
When I spoke to Yokohama, they said it didn't really matter for 100 treadwear tires and above. Might make a difference for the more sticky ones.

Venom
02-23-2017, 04:22 PM
I really liked the RE71Rs, definitely faster than the ZII SS, but they didn't last very long, for reference, I picked up the last set in July and after 4 time attack days (DDT and SMP) and 2 MIR lapping days they were down to the cords and that's with regularly rotating them. I'd estimate I put about 4 hours of total track time on them

Agree....
I was sponsored a set RE71R. Great grip but terrible wear, even on our Cobalt SS.

Nobody run Hankook TD here? I ran them for 2 seasons and swear by them. Corvette and cobalt.

Grant Galloway
02-23-2017, 08:06 PM
I'm still on the fence about what tires to run this year, be it street tires in GT1 or R Compounds in SGT3.

Was not a fan of the wear from the RE71R's but do believe they have an advantage over all the other street tires! The Hankook RS4 will be interesting to see if it is competitive.

I ran Trofeo R's and liked them for both grip and wear, but would love to try a Hankook TD on my car..

Grant

Slowpoke
02-24-2017, 12:03 AM
RE71R definitely wear better than TD's. I had issue with the tread on TD's being ripped down to the belts when (ABS protected) braking on dirty tracks like TMP. Stones tore straight through the "tread" to reveal rubber covered belts. On a lighter, lower HP Honda... might not be an issue.