Acronym confusion

[ScotcH]

Hey all,

Can I just get a confirmation of what the hell all these series acronyms mean? OCC, TGT, GTA,B,C ... I'm kinda confused what series is which, and who runs it (same rule book?). Thanks!

[rmicroys]

Sprints, OCC, GA-1, GT-A, GT-B, GT-C, GT-D all the same series. Called the Ontario Challenge Cup. Sanctioned by CASC-OR, run at events held by CASC-OR clubs such as BARC, BEMC, etc. See rules here -> http://www.casc.on.ca/documents/rregqg-gt.pdf

TGT - CASC Ontario Touring GT Championship, again Sanctioned by CASC-OR, races at events organized by CASC-OR clubs. See rules here -> http://www.casc.on.ca/documents/rregqg-touringgt.pdf

These series are all governed by the following rules:

CASC-OR General Competiton Regulations:
http://www.casc.on.ca/documents/gcr05.pdf

CASC-OR Ontario Region Race Regulations:
http://www.casc.on.ca/documents/rreg05.pdf

The OCC is also covered by the following:
Race Ontario Series Regulations: http://www.casc.on.ca/documents/raceontseries05.pdf

[ScotcH]

Ok ... the mud is settling a bit ...

So on the weight calculator, the touring lines refer to TGT, and the GT lines refer to OCC? Are both series ran on the same days and schedule?

... I think it was the GT in both that confused me :confused:

[Bubblecar]

Scotch -

Close but no cigar.

1. People often speak of the GT Sprints. That's GT-1, GT-A, GT-B, GT-C and GT-D. The OCC (Ontario Challenge Cup) Sprints. This is the bracket racing - cars classified by lap times - if you exceed the lowest allowed time for your class - you "break out" and are excluded from results of that race. Weight of vehicles and tire size / brand are open.

2. Then we have the Touring GT Championships (TGTC). This is the "premier" class and the only one that the weight calculator applies to and TOYO RA-1 tires are manditory. The two original class here were Touring and GT - but this year SGT (Super GT) has been added.

GT-Sprints, # 1 above, (also called alphabet racing) the timed brackets usually run one practice, one qualifying - one (20 min) race on Saturday and two (20 min.) races on Sunday.

The Touring Class (TGTC), # 2 above, run mostly on the same weekends and include one practice, one qualifying, a 20 minute race on Saturday and a 40 minute race on Sunday.

Some drivers enter in only one series - others run in both.

It's quite common to have people pick their main series and then run in the other one on occasion for extra practice / seat time.

[slucas]

You gotta admit, Scotch raises a good point. All these acronyms are confusing. Is there a better way?I like the Austrailian Super V8 series, hardly any acronyms. NASCAR has become so popular that their acronym has become common vernacular, with most people not knowing what it stands for. Our touring car series, which in the past would have been called a sedan series if not for European influence, has a very confusing long form name.
Touring Grand Touring Championship.
Then you add the classes; Touring Grand Touring Touring class -- Touring Grand Touring Grand touring class
and Touring Grand Touring Super Grand Touring.

IS there a better way?
;)

[rmicroys]

Originally posted by ScotcH
Ok ... the mud is settling a bit ...

So on the weight calculator, the touring lines refer to TGT, and the GT lines refer to OCC? Are both series ran on the same days and schedule?

... I think it was the GT in both that confused me :confused:
Nope... the weight calculator is only for applying weights to cars that participate in the Ontario Touring GT Championship, it is not used for the OCC (Ontario Challenge Cup)

There are no modification restrictions, weights or other technical rules - with the exception of the safety technical rules, by with cars in the OCC (GT-1ABCD) must adhere. The only rules for the series really are the lap bracket times.

TGT because of the 'traditional' type of classes - ie, race as fast as you can - rather than the bracket system used in the OCC, the calculator is used to attempt to equalize cars in the series.

[rmicroys]

Originally posted by slucas
IS there a better way?
;)

Ya... sure every car is in its own class ;)

[Gunter Schmidt]

Scott,

The weight calculator is only for Touring GT Championship (TGTC) cars as classified with in the TGTC rules. That means SGT, GT, and T class cars

All Ontario Challenge Cup (OCC) GT-1, GT-A, GT-B, GT-C and GT-D cars are not affected.

The two Championship series are usually competing on the same weekend and many competitors are entered in the two series. A lot of extra track time for $150.00.

I hope that clears some of the confusion.

Gunter

[slucas]

Rob & Gunter, I was only referring to Scotch's confussion about acronyms not about rules.

[ScotcH]

Wow ... so good thing I asked :)

All clear now!

[Bruce Mills]

Actually the two Scotts bring up a good point. While the concepts and rules for these series are great the names of both the series and the classes are incredibly confusing.

Lets start firing off new ideas now and maybe by the Awards Banquet in November we can announce better names for 2006.

[ScotcH]

Originally posted by Bruce Mills
Actually the two Scotts bring up a good point.

Completely unrelated, but my name is Arek. The alias ScotcH came from a stapler, a long time ago (back in Doom 1 days!) :D

[Mike H]

As one of the MMS members standing on a corner every Regional weekend, I am often embarrassed when a spectator or fellow marshal asks which group is on the track.

There must surely be more intuitive titles we could assign to these race groups. If not, let's at least stop using the acronym so frequently in written documents and website forums.

[Bubblecar]

There is obviously a problem here (with series name confusion) but I think we may be part of the problem.

Didn't they try to do something last year by renaming the GT Sprints to OCC (Ontario Challenge Cup) - yet we all (including me) keep refering to GTa-b-c, etc.

If a new name is chosen for any series - it takes a conscious effort to make the re-branding work and let the new name stick.

[Bruce Mills]

Naming the “alphabet soup” series OCC will never catch on. In CASC the name OCC will forever be thought of as the poor cousin of the Canada Challenge Cup. We now have two good series which are unique. They need unique names that reflect a racing heritage but are not confused with any other series presently running.

How about the CASC Ontario Touring Trophy with classes Super TT, TT1 and TT2.

And for the sprints classes keep the series as the GT Sprints with the classes set as GTO(open),GTA. GTB, GTC. and GTD. As well as Formula Sprints for the open wheel diehards.

This is close enough to what we have now that no one should have to much trouble with the switch. All the class names are self explanatory and intuitive. There is enough similarity to other sanctioning body names to understand the concept of the car types yet the names will not be directly confused with those of other series. (Unless IMSA brings back GTO - GTU)

Think about it for the summer, put together your suggestions and next November at the AGM lets set new names that make sense for 2006.

[John Powell]

I like the designations suggested above, except I have a question about the use of "GTO" in GT Sprints. As GTO was (is?) use by Ferrari to designate their cars that have received FIA homologation for racing (and by Pontiac to designate their cars that were never homologated under FIA rules :mad: ), could some take our use of GTO as a class designation as it being open only to FIA homologated cars?

Re the Pontiacs - we used to have a saying back in the '60s. "When is a GTO not a GTO? When it's a Pontiac!" :D

[malcolm]

there isn't a "GTO" in ontario. He meant to say GT1.

However, GTO is used in quebec, and used to be used in IMSA. The "O" stands for "over" (as in over four litres displacement), rather than omologato (sp?), with the "U" obviously meaning "under". :)

[Bruce Mills]

Actually I did mean GTO as the term GT1 has very specific meaning in several series which while similar do not match our bracket racing rules. If GTO is in use in Quebec then we need something similar but unique. Maybe GTX?

[malcolm]

oops, sorry! :)

[karlt]

Bruce has a nice combination of acronyms. Well done! The big confusion is that we have GT Sprints, but then we have the GT class in the TGTC. Too many GTs, and Bruce's suggestion makes nice work of solving it.

Malcolm, BTW, I believe GTO is over 3.0L, and GTU is under 3.0L. That's the case in vintage.

_kT_

[Blue car]

Hey guys! Don't forget about Puresport GT V8 Sprints. which run simultaneously with the OCC GT Sprints . So, now add GTS, GTR, and, GTU to GT1, GTA, and sometimes GTB or GTC but never on a Sunday. This will occur four times this CASC season including the CASCAR weekend which doesn't count. Are you with me so far? Now change to Toyo RA-1's, add some decals and, it's a whole new ball game. You could be in CASC-OR, TGTC-GT, OCC GT-A, Puresport GT GTR all on one Saturday afternoon! In the same car! So, no excuses dust off the car. See you there.
john

[Bruce Mills]

OK someone call Cambells and see if they will sponser a series with the name all the marshals have used for several years allready. ALPHABET SOUP :)

Actually I still like:

Touring Trophy or with a little more support the Toyo Touring Cup with classes as STT, TT1 and TT2.

Puresport V8 with classes, GTS, GTR and GTU.

Closed Wheel Sprints with classes as GTX, GTA, GTB, GTC, and GTD.

But really, as long as the people who are involved know what they want to call themselves does it really matter. It's not like we actually have any outside spectators or sponsers to worry about confusing.

Oh, maybe if ????????