Noob Classing Question

[s2krentacar]

My s2000 can be run as either A Stock , or B SS/SP..

whats the point of having 2 classes?

Thanks

[s2krentacar]

Ahh, does it mean that as I modify my car, it only goes up to BSS instead of ASS? I'd never want to be an ASS for obvious reasons :-p

Any recommendations for what other mods I should do to the S2k. I just want an excuse to get a V2 Cold air intake cause i like the wooshing noise it makes...
I'd be looking for the most cost effective ways to increase performance..

[miataboi]

I used to be the ASS master... back in 2003.


For a STOOK... LEAVE IT STOCK!

It's a DONINATING stock car.

HARD to improve.

Having said that... the first coupla years were BETTER auto-x stock cars...
More loopy / tail-happy... but PEFECTLY driven... that makes it a better auto-x car with the HIGHER redline.... which makes it more flexible for auto-x... esp Ontario auto-x... where you can leave it in 1st the whole time!!! NO SHIFTING!

If it's a later S2200... then PERHAPS SS is a good prep level with a PROPER suspension that would eneble it to pivot.

Then you can do the intake... and MAYBE a flywheel or header or something like that.

But the early S2K's were DOMINANT stock.

Back when it was OBVIOUS that Taylor was fast... (meaning NOT in a CIVIC!!!!) He started to KICK AZZ in his last full year of S2K-dom

To see how your car CURRENTLY performs... seriously... let him co-drive it for an event... either that... or let him have 2 fun-runs in it!

You will NOT modify your car after he shows you how an S2K can be driven.
Seriously.

[B18C5]

I'm not so sure that the older ones are better. It's been debated endlessly on s2ki. There have obviously been both generations brought out to national events, but there haven't been any FULLY prepared 04/05 (AP2) models campaigned nationally. The general consensus is that after enough development the AP2s will be faster than the AP1s.

You also have to keep in mind the SCCA stock class rules, which allow for unlimited mods to the front anti-roll bar, but nothing to the rear. Plus they allow for unlimited shocks, but require the stock wheel sizes.

Competitive A Stock AP1s actually vary in rear tire size, but we don't care about that right now. They're either set up with stock shocks, and a REALLY thick front anti-roll bar, or sometimes they use aftermarket ones, like stupid crazy ones like Motons. But they don't make a huge difference. But everyone uses a big front bar to get rid of some of that tail happiness. They also use an alignment with a lot of toe-in in the rear to keep the tail in line.

Since the AP2s don't oversteer as much as the AP1s, it's fairly safe to assume that there isn't as much a need for a front bar. I'm not too good of a judge yet, but it's been a struggle to keep my tail in check. Plus there's the difference of wheel and tire sizes... oh yeah, I haven't touched on that yet.

Wheel size went from 16x6.5 / 16x7.5 to 17x7 / 17x8.5, so there's a wider contact patch available, especially in the rear. The optimal AP1 tire size is 225/50 / 245/45, but on the AP2 you can (barely) fit 245/45 / 275/40 V710s. I think that's a HUGE difference. They are taller, so the gearing suffers, but in the US they usually have courses that top out at 60mph, and with the taller tires you might actually get to do that in second gear.

Either way, with whatever tire combo you run on the AP2 it'll have a nicer rear contact patch, which will also help reduce the need for a front anti-roll bar.

As for the engine/gearing differences between the AP1 and AP2, it depends on the course of course. They AP2 has more torque, and a broader area under the curve. It's also rumoured to have more power when dynoed back to back with an AP1, but that's hard to generalize. It does have slightly shorter gearing too.

So what I'm trying to say is there's no reason not to run an AP2 in stock class. It might be better.

Awww, hell. It's all in THIS FAQ (http://forums.s2ki.com/forums/index.php?showtopic=172595) better than I could tell you.

[Marsh]

Yea I've driven Tim's car at a slalom and a 2005 on the street. The ballance seemed similar, but the 2005's better bottom end was quite handy. I think the newer ones might be faster. There has also been speculation that Honda under quotes the power of the newer engine.

[s2krentacar]

I am a noob, but i don't think I can pull 3 more seconds to run with the STIs in AStock...or can I?

[nitrowsb]

I am a noob, but i don't think I can pull 3 more seconds to run with the STIs in AStock...or can I?


I'm sure you can...just slow down a little! I drove you're car, and the only the second RWD i've ever driven and it's awsome! Virtually NO understeer and very tail happy and like all the better drivers than me have always maintained(and it's true) SLOW IN FAST OUT!

I personally think that the STI is an easier car to learn to drive fast than any RWD car but once you learn to control a RWD car, it can be faster as long as you put enough tight turns into the course :D :p

But i'm a noob as well so let's hear from the more experience guys...

[B18C5]

The A-Stock car to have is a C4 Vette. But after that it's anyone's guess. Some people are into the Boxter, some people into STIs and EVOs, some people believe S2000s. Last year at the nationals when the S2000s were in B-Stock they were faster than the C4s running A-Stock, so the S2000 might be the car to have. I think that's why they were moved up as well.

But if you're having problems catching the other cars in a stock class, why do you think it would be easier running in a modified class?

[s2krentacar]

The A-Stock car to have is a C4 Vette. But after that it's anyone's guess. Some people are into the Boxter, some people into STIs and EVOs, some people believe S2000s. Last year at the nationals when the S2000s were in B-Stock they were faster than the C4s running A-Stock, so the S2000 might be the car to have. I think that's why they were moved up as well.

But if you're having problems catching the other cars in a stock class, why do you think it would be easier running in a modified class?


I didn't say anything about it being easier at all. I'm just saying that if my car isn't competitive, then i might as well prep the car the way i want it. With an intake!

[gatherer]

even though a C4 vette is the "car to have" for A-stock... you have to also look at the number of C4 vettes coming out. not many if any... I haven't seen any except at the corvette events. so even though there is a "car to have" if it doesn't come out your s2k might be very competitive in the stock classes

[J.C.]

I don't see why the C4 is the car to have in A-stock. Atleast not up here with our courses.

[s2krentacar]

After having driven Trung's car, I'm convinved the STI is the car to beat in A stock. Its a MONSTER. Its got 60 more horsepower, 150 ft/lbs more torque than my S2000 and an advanced AWD system with all sorts of magic diffs. My first time in his car i equalled my best time in my S2000. That echos Trungs sentiment that its easier to learn in his car and obviously i'm still a NOOB, but that STI is a unbelievable.

[nitrowsb]

After having driven Trung's car, I'm convinved the STI is the car to beat in A stock. Its a MONSTER. Its got 60 more horsepower, 150 ft/lbs more torque than my S2000 and an advanced AWD system with all sorts of magic diffs. My first time in his car i equalled my best time in my S2000. That echos Trungs sentiment that its easier to learn in his car and obviously i'm still a NOOB, but that STI is a unbelievable.

You also underteered throughout the whole course :eek: :eek: poor tires!

But don't forget I beat you by 2 seconds my second run in your car :D :D but we are both noobs and have a lot to learn still...

[JoeT]

After having driven Trung's car, I'm convinved the STI is the car to beat in A stock. Its a MONSTER. Its got 60 more horsepower, 150 ft/lbs more torque than my S2000 and an advanced AWD system with all sorts of magic diffs. My first time in his car i equalled my best time in my S2000. That echos Trungs sentiment that its easier to learn in his car and obviously i'm still a NOOB, but that STI is a unbelievable.

When you're ready for an STI, the SPDA will be there to help you with your purchase. Aaaaahhhh, the beauty of AWD.

LOL

[slai]

But don't forget I beat you by 2 seconds my second run in your car :D :D

Do you do that with EVERYONE's car? :D

[nitrowsb]

Do you do that with EVERYONE's car? :D


I'm sure that most if not all of the veterans would have done the same( not saying that i'm one) and the faster guys would have gone even faster!

I think that's a good thing because you'll know there is room for improvement...personally, that hasn't happen to me yet but I'm SURE one of those TOP DOGS out there would like to put me in my place :D :D

I would be more than happy to obliged(sp) but hurry before my warranty runs out. They're running low on axles :p :eek: