View Full Version : Shannonville getting slick?
02-06-2001, 12:31 PM
Did anyone find that Shannonville is getting slicker and slicker? My times were down from last year on street tires. For my car, at least, I found the track very slippery in Y2K.
[Edited by Shaman on 02-07-2001 at 09:48 AM]
02-06-2001, 12:37 PM
I totally agree. Especially towards the end of the year. Turn 1 in particular seems to have caught a lot of people this year (including me).
I'm not sure what it is though. Is it that the surface is just getting old and tired, has had too much oil dumped on it over the years, too many marbles, all of the above?
02-06-2001, 12:42 PM
I'd say all of the above. Although Eric's tranny fluid didn't do my tires any great favours. :eek:
My solid-axle car is really nervous on Shannonville these days. The accleration zones coming out of corners are getting my car spinning more than it ever has.
I'm interested to know how other cars are faring. Specifically other kinds of cars than mine. :)
02-06-2001, 01:28 PM
I did limited lapping at Shannonville this year, but I know I had more trouble with Turn 1 in September than I did in May/June. I thought it was setup, which concerned me 'cuz it felt okay in the other corners. That makes me feel a bit better... :D
Wonder how the sport bikes like that?
02-06-2001, 01:40 PM
I think it's all good to sportbikes as long as you don't hit something. :)
02-06-2001, 05:20 PM
Well Iíve only been to the track 3 times before last session. Once in a Kart and twice in a FF1600. Both are pretty different then my current 87 Rex.
But you know what......almost everybody went 2 seconds faster on Pro-track compared to the beginning of the season. If you find it to be more slippery then look at the outside variables. Weather and the "Driver" to be exact. I believe it was colder at the end of the year. Also you have to take into consideration that a BIG ASS rainfall might have washed the track earlier in the week before we were there. As a rule tracks will tend to be faster by the end of a season because of all the rubber that gets laid down through the season. Also at the beginning of the season nobody has driven there cars for a few months thus people won't be as aggressive with the car. It's all in your head!!
Actually there was one track that Iíve raced at , it was getting worse because the season kept on going. They repaved Whibty kart track in the spring so the asphalt didn't have time to cure. Us karters went out...by the end of the season we had to sweep the track in-between races to get the lose asphalt off the track, if you think snow is slippery.....it made for a 1 line race track. No passing really, except for a love tap.
Getting excessive wheelspin coming out of the corners at Shannonville, I just wish my car had enough power to have this be a problem.
02-06-2001, 07:11 PM
Somehow I knew that would come up in conversation. :)
I definitely felt like Shannonville was slicker this summer than last, particularly turn 1 on Nelson and the S-turns on Fabi just before you jump on the straight. They all seemed much greasier to me, although part of that may have been worn tires.
Still, from what Pete and Eric tell me, Shannonville has definitely gotten slower over the years. They both felt it was a combination of less grip due to track conditions and worse tires. They actually think r-compounds have gotten worse in recent years. Anyhoo, if you look at some of the Solo 1 lap times from 5 to 10 years ago, you'll see that the track has definitely slowed.
I wonder if a similar trend has been seen on the big track at Mosport as the pavement aged? I'm guess so.
02-07-2001, 09:47 AM
I've heard that the big track is like glass when it rains, but... can't speak from experience.
I must get on that track this year. I'm interested to know if I can reach the top of fifth gear, which is 165mph or so with the 4.10 rear gears. I hit 155mph at Road Atlanta with 3.73 rear gears and the car in rotten running condition (burnt brakes, overwhelmed shocks, bad computer program).
I've only been on it someone else's car. :(
Regarding Pro Track being faster at the end of the season: the Pro takes some getting used to because it's genuinely fast for the amount of time your car is in a corner. Play your cards right on the Pro and you can really feel adrenaline. I never got a chance to optimize my driving on the Pro with R compound tires - I was only running a second faster with R compound and a new suspension than I was in 1999 with street tires. However, I do believe that the track had a lot to do with this.
Oddly, I didn't feel turn 1 on Nelson was slick at all. I'd blast in with fourth gear, brake slightly and power through the turn slightly to get a little oversteer. Someone told me they didn't think anyone was going through it faster than I was, though. Maybe my car likes turn 1. :)
It's turn two that messes with you. At the end of the day's fun run in September, I was lapping at least 0.5 seconds faster than I was during the events, and I undoubtedly could have pulled another 0.5 off it because I knew where to make up some time. Alas, fun runs were over and the car started understeering the next day badly at Fabi. I've since discovered the front end is not quite what it was. Repair time...
The Mosport DDT, now on that track I feel like my car has fantastic traction. I can pull the throttle back a little and the tail moves out, or I can hammer the brake and the car just stops. Wonderful stuff... I was even running fairly hot laps on street tires.
[Edited by Shaman on 02-07-2001 at 09:57 AM]
02-07-2001, 03:34 PM
I believe Huns Stuck(sp?) said Mosport felt as slippery as owl shit in the rain, what ever that means.
I asked my dad about shannonville and he really doesn't think the track is any slower. Except corner 3 on pro-track because of the grooves and really rough pavement. And I know the FF1600 would go faster every year but thatís probably because of technological advances.
02-07-2001, 04:17 PM
These times are from the secret archives ...
The fastest times from non-modified classes
1991 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 53.409
1992 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 53.727
1993 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 53.806
1994 Danny Vistoli 71 Datsun 240Z 53.420
1995 Tony McGrath ?? Porsche 911 53.697
1996 Danny Vistoli 71 Datsun 240Z 53.986
1997 Rick Potter 93 Mazda RX7 53.767
1998 Tony McGrath 97 Camaro SS 54.035
1999 Mike Boekdrukker 88 BMW M3 54.496
2000 Eric Juraschka 86 Corvette 55.428
1991 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 72.715
1992 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 72.750
1993 Danny Vistoli 71 Datsun 240Z 72.472
1994 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 71.968
1995 Rick Potter 93 Mazda RX7 73.059
1996 Peter Wright 70 Datsun 240Z 72.318
1997 Danny Vistoli 71 Datsun 240Z 71.979
1998 Eric Juraschka 86 Corvette 71.649
1999 Eric Juraschka 86 Corvette 73.332
2000 Eric Juraschka 86 Corvette 72.150
02-07-2001, 06:01 PM
These secret archives you speak of...... is there anyway the common competitor could gain access to them. I would be more then happy to post them on the net for ALL to see.
Give them back to the people!!! :)
Also, could you send me the results from the last 3 seasons that were converted to the standards of the new Classification system. I am aware the CCC has made these conversions. There is no point for me to waste time doing it when it has already been done.
02-07-2001, 11:17 PM
Of course, the archives aren't secret, they're just hard to get!!
Victor Del Col emailed me a bunch of spreadsheets with everyone's fastest times from '91 to '00, which was my source for my first post.
I will forward these to you tomorrow.
As for the CCC, I created an 'unofficial' spreadsheet with data from 1999 and 2000 events in order to figure out how class populations would be affected by break point and family classification changes.
It needs updating to conform with the latest amendments but I'll be happy to share it with you when I'm done.
One thing to keep in mind when using prior data to 'reclassify' past events: it isn't reliable.
Since Solo 1 uses run groups based on the classes a car gets registered in the event with these cars would not necessarily have run the same times if they had gone out at different times during the day.
Additionaly, since competitors react differently to the presence (or absence) of competition, who is to say that their performance would have been as strong (or weak) if the people they had to beat were different? This effect multiplies over several events since it would also affect whether certain competitors would even show up!
BTW, those are the reasons why I'm against any sort of 'double scoring' during a season. Naturally nothing prevents an individual from doing their own calculations...
That said, being a curious fellow I would no doubt have used data from many more previous years of competition, if it had been available to me. Does anyone know where to get individual event results from years prior to 1999?
02-08-2001, 07:08 PM
Thanks. I really appreciate it.
I have a lot of the results from early seventies or early eighties to early nineties. My dad kept all the stuff from when he raced SOLO the first time around. I should have a look to see what's there.
Is anybody interested in that?
Just send me everything you have:)
BTW did you have a look at my attempts to adjust last yearís results? If not go here:
I have also made the adjustments that the amendment required.
Dave Barker, could you confirm your car was stock last season and that it fits into A2 Stock.
I have already put you into this group, if your car wasnít stock or it doesn't fit into that category let me know and Iíll take it out.
02-08-2001, 09:19 PM
So what does the evidence I dug up prove?
On first glance I'd say there is no discernable trend in Fabi and that perhaps Nelson is slowing up a bit. The guy who'd really know would be Peter Wright, wouldn't it?
02-13-2001, 10:13 AM
Christian: Could you maybe put those spreadsheets online or something? I'd be very very intersted to see something like that myself, and I'm sure like everybody else would too. Thanks.
02-13-2001, 12:26 PM
I'll post them on my website when i get home from school.
I have converted them to a formate that is printable...........
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